Suggestions for a homemade mix
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Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Mouserat Sat 27 Jun 2020, 8:15 pm
I've been feeding my girls a store bought seed mix that i removed the pellets from (they were mainly corn) and replaced with oxbow essentials adult rat food. I've been hoping to switch to a homemade diet for a long time now but i never had the money but now a homemade mix would essentially be cheaper then what I'm feeding now and would be less wasteful. I've looked through a lot of different recipes and I'm getting a little lost especially with the percentages and everything so if anybody has any suggestions they'll be apreceated lol.
Mouserat- New Member
- Join date : 2020-06-27
Posts : 11
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Robin~ Wed 01 Jul 2020, 7:14 am
Hello!
I assure you, a commercial mix will always be less expensive than a homemade mix, at least if you make a high quality one and not one made from your pantry/table scraps. The start up costs for mine were close to $50, but I already had most of the seeds/grains from my treat bin so the actual scratch cost is likely closer to $100. Commercial mixes are what, $10-15 for 2lbs? Don’t get me wrong, homemade mixes are a fantastic way to provide a high quality, varied mix, but don’t go into it thinking you’ll be saving money.
If you wanted to create your own mix, though, knowing it’ll be more expensive, I’d suggest giving these articles a read. They are based off hamsters, so for mice they’ll look a little different due to their different nutritional requirements, but the main concepts are similar.
The first is a series (the rest is linked at the top of the first) that is like a Diet 101. It explains how to mix a food and what to look for in a food. You probably don’t need to read IV and V since those are more hamster specific but they can give you an idea of what high quality looks like and what foods you could use.
http://hamsterhideout.com/forum/topic/98950-hamster-nutrition-i-nutrition-variety-and-quality/#entry1017311
The second goes into detail about homemade diets:
http://hamsterhideout.com/forum/topic/113437-creating-a-homemade-hamster-diet/#entry1204421
I generally tend to tweak the recommended percentages for each group for variety and GA reasons. Here’s what my current mix is (appx.):
60% grains
15% seeds
5% legumes
10% vegetables
5% animal proteins
5% nuts
So, basically, I took down the legumes since those are high in protein and mice reportedly can’t process them well anyways. For veggies, I found 30% was high even for hamsters, so I stick to 10-15%. Then, the grains and seeds were increased to account for the difference. The final mix will likely be very rich—mine is close to 15% protein, 12% fat, and 13% fiber—but this can be tweaked by adding in Oxbow and a low-protein food (such as a bird seed mix).
If you have any further questions let me know!
I assure you, a commercial mix will always be less expensive than a homemade mix, at least if you make a high quality one and not one made from your pantry/table scraps. The start up costs for mine were close to $50, but I already had most of the seeds/grains from my treat bin so the actual scratch cost is likely closer to $100. Commercial mixes are what, $10-15 for 2lbs? Don’t get me wrong, homemade mixes are a fantastic way to provide a high quality, varied mix, but don’t go into it thinking you’ll be saving money.
If you wanted to create your own mix, though, knowing it’ll be more expensive, I’d suggest giving these articles a read. They are based off hamsters, so for mice they’ll look a little different due to their different nutritional requirements, but the main concepts are similar.
The first is a series (the rest is linked at the top of the first) that is like a Diet 101. It explains how to mix a food and what to look for in a food. You probably don’t need to read IV and V since those are more hamster specific but they can give you an idea of what high quality looks like and what foods you could use.
http://hamsterhideout.com/forum/topic/98950-hamster-nutrition-i-nutrition-variety-and-quality/#entry1017311
The second goes into detail about homemade diets:
http://hamsterhideout.com/forum/topic/113437-creating-a-homemade-hamster-diet/#entry1204421
I generally tend to tweak the recommended percentages for each group for variety and GA reasons. Here’s what my current mix is (appx.):
60% grains
15% seeds
5% legumes
10% vegetables
5% animal proteins
5% nuts
So, basically, I took down the legumes since those are high in protein and mice reportedly can’t process them well anyways. For veggies, I found 30% was high even for hamsters, so I stick to 10-15%. Then, the grains and seeds were increased to account for the difference. The final mix will likely be very rich—mine is close to 15% protein, 12% fat, and 13% fiber—but this can be tweaked by adding in Oxbow and a low-protein food (such as a bird seed mix).
If you have any further questions let me know!
_________________
Mice: Raven
Other: Hermes (robo hamster), Prism (betta), Max (dog--profile pic)
Rainbow Kids: Pepper, Nugget, Dove, Artemis (hamsters), Leaf, Oak, and Moo (mice)
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Posts : 444
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Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Mouserat Mon 13 Jul 2020, 1:30 pm
Hi, thank you so much for all of the information!
Based of what you said following the prices of everything i do think a commercial mix would be more in my price range. Though my issue is that where i live there aren't really any good mixes for sale and i haven't found anything online that's available yet. Do you know of any ways i can alter or add something to a commercial mix to make it more nutritionally sound without going completely for the homemade rout?
Based of what you said following the prices of everything i do think a commercial mix would be more in my price range. Though my issue is that where i live there aren't really any good mixes for sale and i haven't found anything online that's available yet. Do you know of any ways i can alter or add something to a commercial mix to make it more nutritionally sound without going completely for the homemade rout?
Mouserat- New Member
- Join date : 2020-06-27
Posts : 11
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Robin~ Tue 14 Jul 2020, 11:17 am
What country do you live in? I'd be happy to help you find one if need be. 
In the meantime I have this list of commercial foods that may be worth looking at (it's mainly for North Americans and Europeans): Mouse Food Dissection
While there isn't a whole lot you can do to the main diet if you can't create a balanced mix, you can add in what are called "mix-ins". These are various grains and seeds that can be added in small amounts to the main diet to help with variety. The legumes, nuts, and seeds table of this article goes into more detail.
In the meantime I have this list of commercial foods that may be worth looking at (it's mainly for North Americans and Europeans): Mouse Food DissectionWhile there isn't a whole lot you can do to the main diet if you can't create a balanced mix, you can add in what are called "mix-ins". These are various grains and seeds that can be added in small amounts to the main diet to help with variety. The legumes, nuts, and seeds table of this article goes into more detail.
_________________
Mice: Raven
Other: Hermes (robo hamster), Prism (betta), Max (dog--profile pic)
Rainbow Kids: Pepper, Nugget, Dove, Artemis (hamsters), Leaf, Oak, and Moo (mice)
Robin~- Sr Member
- Join date : 2019-06-05
Posts : 444
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Mouserat Wed 15 Jul 2020, 6:47 pm
I do live in North America.
I was looking at the bunny gerbil dream expert and the dwarf hamster one as well but they seem to be a uk brand only if I'm not mistaken. Do you know of any that would be available to me?
As for pellets id like to stay on the oxbow but im also open to switching to something like science selective rat food as well.
I was looking at the bunny gerbil dream expert and the dwarf hamster one as well but they seem to be a uk brand only if I'm not mistaken. Do you know of any that would be available to me?
As for pellets id like to stay on the oxbow but im also open to switching to something like science selective rat food as well.
Mouserat- New Member
- Join date : 2020-06-27
Posts : 11
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by chiroptera Thu 16 Jul 2020, 9:40 pm
I actually e-mailed regarding the Bunny dream brand I believe, and they're only available in Europe. 
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Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Robin~ Fri 17 Jul 2020, 12:24 pm
Mouserat wrote:I do live in North America.
I was looking at the bunny gerbil dream expert and the dwarf hamster one as well but they seem to be a uk brand only if I'm not mistaken. Do you know of any that would be available to me?
As for pellets id like to stay on the oxbow but im also open to switching to something like science selective rat food as well.
I know, they're such great mixes and it stinks we can't get our hands on them! :/ It might be worth separating the list into Euro foods and NA foods; I'll work on that then.
Thankfully, there are still some other great foods on the list like the Higgins mixes and Brown's Tropical Carnival that would also work well! Most of the alright mixes can also work well with some tweaking (ex, if you wanted to use Sunseed Parakeet, you could mix that with another food that's high in variety, such as Puur Hamster Food, of course still including Oxbow).
_________________
Mice: Raven
Other: Hermes (robo hamster), Prism (betta), Max (dog--profile pic)
Rainbow Kids: Pepper, Nugget, Dove, Artemis (hamsters), Leaf, Oak, and Moo (mice)
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- Join date : 2019-06-05
Posts : 444
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Mouserat Sat 18 Jul 2020, 12:11 pm
Ok thank you so much on all of this lol
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Posts : 11
Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by AmoraChinchilla Wed 26 Aug 2020, 3:44 am
I know this thread was from awhile ago but I just wanted to mention, as someone who makes their own mix it's actually not that expensive if you make it in bulk.
Granted, I'm currently in Denmark so maybe it's different for other areas, but my prices break down (dkk translated to usd) to something like:
750g (1.65lbs) rat/mouse food: about $15
Bulk 15kg (33lb) bag of rat/mouse food online: about $30
Already the bulk price is better, as tends to be the case, but that's not including shipping- which can be another 5-10 dollars or so.
But here's the thing- 15kg (33lbs) of grains from the farmer supply store only costs about $8, less than even that original less-than-2-pound bag of feed from the store. My mix includes 4 different whole grains and 2 different processed grains (one of which is literally just an unsweetened bulk bag of corn flakes, which we got a bunch of damaged boxes of for free, but can easily be replaced with any other grain.)
Pretty much all the main grains cost around that $8 mark, which brings a good mix of grains up to about $48 for 90kg (198lbs) of grain. Protein has to be bought in smaller amounts generally, but seed mixes are easy- I was able to get a huge 25kg (55lbs) bag of budgie seed mix for about $48. Then you just need peas/legumes (very small percentage, can also be bought at the farmer store in bulk), protein, and herbs.
Deied peas can also be bought at a farm store here, usually marketed for rabbits or birds, for closer to $15 for 15kg (33lbs).
My protein sources are a mix of crickets, meal worms, and high quality dog food (look for salmon or chicken as the first ingredient! Avoid chicken FAT, however.) If you're getting a big thing of dog food this could run you about $30 for a 25lb bag or so, as far as a quick google search tells me. But you can also sub the dog food for soya, insect, or even fresh meat. I often cook up tiny bits of unseasoned chicken for the mice, and while some aren't a fan, others would decide to eat only that if they could.
Herb/veggie mixes are usually more expensive, but here's the fun thing- they say not to give table scraps to your animals, but honestly you CAN if they're healthy scraps. (Though for real, don't feed them human leftovers. Just just parts of veggies you don't use.)
You can easily dehydrate things like carrot ends and peels, broccoli stems, bits of kale, whatever you eat- as long as you double check that it's good for your mice.
Herbs and veggies make up a very small percentage of the diet, so I always save what they can eat and cut it up into tiny pieces. Then you just dehydrate, and if you have a small number of animals, this can easily make up the requirements for their intake- just make sure that you're putting in things that they'll actually need to thrive.
All in all, my mix comes out to roughly $140 for 311lbs of food. Give or take a little on smaller amounts of ingredients you might have to buy (such as veggies/herbs, if you don't have the patience/time to dehydrate or simply don't eat the types of things you could give to your mice.)
This saves literally over $2000 on the small bag of food, and even on the bulk bag of food saves just over $140.
And of course you're not going to use that much. Not all at once, anyway. Probably not for several years if you only have one group of animals. But these items are all preserved, and won't go bad if stored properly, so if you expect to have mice for a long time yet it doesn't hurt to try it out. You can always go in on it with friends (as we do frequently with a breeder friend of ours) or simply buy ingredients one at a time.
The big thing, I suppose, is that it can in fact be a lot less expensive to make your own mix- as long as you're doing it in bulk. Although it feels like a big hit to your pockets, getting that big bag of brown rice that's $30 can save you hundreds over a small bag that's $3.
For me, it's worth it. For others it may not be. But it's worth mentioning that it is possible to save money and give your mice a mix where you know everything that's in it.
Granted, I'm currently in Denmark so maybe it's different for other areas, but my prices break down (dkk translated to usd) to something like:
750g (1.65lbs) rat/mouse food: about $15
Bulk 15kg (33lb) bag of rat/mouse food online: about $30
Already the bulk price is better, as tends to be the case, but that's not including shipping- which can be another 5-10 dollars or so.
But here's the thing- 15kg (33lbs) of grains from the farmer supply store only costs about $8, less than even that original less-than-2-pound bag of feed from the store. My mix includes 4 different whole grains and 2 different processed grains (one of which is literally just an unsweetened bulk bag of corn flakes, which we got a bunch of damaged boxes of for free, but can easily be replaced with any other grain.)
Pretty much all the main grains cost around that $8 mark, which brings a good mix of grains up to about $48 for 90kg (198lbs) of grain. Protein has to be bought in smaller amounts generally, but seed mixes are easy- I was able to get a huge 25kg (55lbs) bag of budgie seed mix for about $48. Then you just need peas/legumes (very small percentage, can also be bought at the farmer store in bulk), protein, and herbs.
Deied peas can also be bought at a farm store here, usually marketed for rabbits or birds, for closer to $15 for 15kg (33lbs).
My protein sources are a mix of crickets, meal worms, and high quality dog food (look for salmon or chicken as the first ingredient! Avoid chicken FAT, however.) If you're getting a big thing of dog food this could run you about $30 for a 25lb bag or so, as far as a quick google search tells me. But you can also sub the dog food for soya, insect, or even fresh meat. I often cook up tiny bits of unseasoned chicken for the mice, and while some aren't a fan, others would decide to eat only that if they could.
Herb/veggie mixes are usually more expensive, but here's the fun thing- they say not to give table scraps to your animals, but honestly you CAN if they're healthy scraps. (Though for real, don't feed them human leftovers. Just just parts of veggies you don't use.)
You can easily dehydrate things like carrot ends and peels, broccoli stems, bits of kale, whatever you eat- as long as you double check that it's good for your mice.
Herbs and veggies make up a very small percentage of the diet, so I always save what they can eat and cut it up into tiny pieces. Then you just dehydrate, and if you have a small number of animals, this can easily make up the requirements for their intake- just make sure that you're putting in things that they'll actually need to thrive.
All in all, my mix comes out to roughly $140 for 311lbs of food. Give or take a little on smaller amounts of ingredients you might have to buy (such as veggies/herbs, if you don't have the patience/time to dehydrate or simply don't eat the types of things you could give to your mice.)
This saves literally over $2000 on the small bag of food, and even on the bulk bag of food saves just over $140.
And of course you're not going to use that much. Not all at once, anyway. Probably not for several years if you only have one group of animals. But these items are all preserved, and won't go bad if stored properly, so if you expect to have mice for a long time yet it doesn't hurt to try it out. You can always go in on it with friends (as we do frequently with a breeder friend of ours) or simply buy ingredients one at a time.
The big thing, I suppose, is that it can in fact be a lot less expensive to make your own mix- as long as you're doing it in bulk. Although it feels like a big hit to your pockets, getting that big bag of brown rice that's $30 can save you hundreds over a small bag that's $3.
For me, it's worth it. For others it may not be. But it's worth mentioning that it is possible to save money and give your mice a mix where you know everything that's in it.
AmoraChinchilla- New Member
- Join date : 2020-04-17
Posts : 6
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Re: Suggestions for a homemade mix
by Mouserat Wed 28 Oct 2020, 8:00 pm
AmoraChinchilla this was really interesting and ill definitely be looking at bulk options thank you.
Mouserat- New Member
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